Supernatural superhero

Caroline Elliott interviewed Ghost Rider star Nicolas Cage in FS 22. Here she talks to Director Mark Steven Johnson about how he made the film and transformed Nic.

The Ghost Rider comic book has had several incarnations, how did you choose which to use in the film?

Ghost Rider has had a couple of different incarnations, with Danny Ketch being the latest in the 90s. And before that there was the original, Johnny Blaze, in the 70s.  I got to cherry pick the best of both.

I love the original Faust tale of Johnny Blaze, to me that was the most important. The movie is all about choice and second chances, and so I really wanted to tell a modern day Faustian tale, but also use some of the great imagery from the Danny Ketch era.

How did you make the decision to cast Peter Fonda as The Devil?

For me it was obvious I wanted to get the biggest motorcycle icon to play the Devil in my motorcycle movie. But also there was something else that turned me on, in that we were trying to make a Gothic western, which is a new idea in a way.

One of the best westerns for my money is Once Upon A Time In The West, and of course his father Henry Fonda was the villain in that. As Peter gets older he’s looking like Henry, so there’s something really cool about seeing your villain out there in the desert, with that tanned face, and it’s a Fonda. It felt like I got two nods for the price of one. I also feel like it’s the first crossover, Captain America versus Ghost Rider.
 
What was it like shooting in Australia?

Australia was wonderful, the people were fantastic, they really adopted us. Unlike LA, they don’t film much at all in Melbourne, we were like the first big movie there, so it was new to them, they wanted to help us and bent over backwards to make things work out. It’s really a Valentine to the city, it’s beautiful. I miss it so much.

What was your take on Nic’s transformation scene?

I think that what made it so special, was when I wrote the scene I envisioned it only as pain, an incredibly painful transformation going on. 

But as Nic rightly said ‘it’s painful for Johnny, but it feels good for the Ghost Rider,’ and I think that’s really where you get that Jekyll & Hyde vibe, where those screams of terror and pain turn into maniacal laughter.  That’s when it feels like you’re seeing something kind of special.

Is ‘the penance stare’ a metaphor for the film business?

What Nic was saying, Ghost Rider – whatever he looks like – he doesn’t kill. That was always the interesting thing about the character in the comic. He takes out demons, because they’re not humans. But he will not take a human life, ever. So the penance stare is a really interesting way to make someone pay for their sins, and still spare their lives.

I always envisaged it like being in a room and someone cements the windows, and you can’t look out forever, you’re just stuck in there with everything you’ve done and whatever sins you’ve committed. I thought that was a really ingenious thing that the original writers came up with.

Were you apprehensive with Ghost Rider after the experience on Daredevil?

I was apprehensive, certainly Daredevil was a flawed movie, I still love it, but the Director’s Cut is 30 minutes longer than the actual cut.  It’s a very different film. It’s always a nice but a backhanded compliment when people say ‘I really loved Daredevil – the Director’s Cut’.

In this case I had a studio that had had a lot of success with Spider-Man, so they trust Marvel and they trust the comic character, and I know they trusted me. I knew I wasn’t going to have conversations like I did on Daredevil where I’d have to fight over the costume.

There wasn’t going to be anyone at Sony saying ‘does it have to be a skull, that’s ridiculous!’. And then having a star in Nic, who is as big a fan as I am, that’s the best of both worlds. You feel a level of safety there, that everyone gets it.

Effects wise could you do everything you want in this movie?

I started writing this movie back in May 2003, that’s how long I’ve been on this flick, and I just finished the movie a week ago. I was tweaking effects up until then. Kevin Mack and the gang at SPI [Sony Pictures Imageworks] were creating new programmes as we were going, throughout.

It couldn’t have been done a year ago, and that was when we were supposed to be finsihed. I’m very thankful that we had the time.  Now your imagination isn’t limited by what is possible, Ghost Rider couldn’t have been made a few years ago, at least not made right, it would have been really cheesy.

We needed the fire in this movie to be a part of his personality, because we didn’t have any other facial features to make him look or feel real. It was really important that we had the time to make it right, it’s a better movie for it.

Did you have trouble keeping Peter Fonda off a bike during the shoot?

I remember one night we were shooting at about three in the morning. Peter wasn’t working that night, and downtown Melbourne was obviously shut down at that time of night. But this motorcycle was tearing around, echoing off the buildings.

We had to stop shooting, and all of a sudden this racing bike pulls up and it’s Fonda ‘hey man’!.  He’s the real deal, Nic and I have both kept off bikes a bit lately, with children in our lives and whatnot, but Peter is non-stop, he’s riding non-stop, he goes all the time. He’s something else.